Air intakes and big air flow numbers???? - Kawasaki Teryx Forums: Kawasaki UTV Teryx Forum
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post #1 of 9 (permalink) Old 10-08-2008, 09:40 PM Thread Starter
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Air intakes and big air flow numbers????

Been thinking about some ads I see for intakes and most sport some pretty lofty air flow numbers. Sounds great huh? Not really.

The Teryx motor at 100% efficiency can't pump but about 90 CFM if I remember right, it has been a while since I calculated it. The engine may be 90% efficient at best so we are down to only 81 cfm. So if the air pump (engine) can only pump 81 cfm do we need a air intake that will flow more? If it will flow 81 then we have enough period.

I like to use analogies and I like to use water and pipes for it, I guess because I was a fire fighter for 17 plus years.

Say you went and bought a brand new water hose nozzle that will flow 50 gallons per minute (GPM) and you had a water hose that would flow 55 GPM. Now your neighbor comes over and tells you, you need to borrow his new 5" water hose that flows 1000 GPM and then you can rinse your UTV off quicker. You tell him your nozzle will only flow 50 GPM, he says yeah but mine hose flows way more, again you tell him the nozzle will only let out 50 GPM and since your present hose will flow 55 gpm you already can't flow what your own hose can flow and then he finally gets it and realizes, "Crap that guy at the Big Flowing Hoses Store tricked me" Believing his new 5" hose was the bomb now he realizes that his big hideous looking hose is way over kill for any use at all.

There was a air intake company who built a air intake for a Rhino and never dyno tested it on a Rhino before they made it, but they sure put it on the flow bench and showed how much it would flow. Guess what happen when we put it on the Rhino? It would run out out of power before the stock intake would and it was because they lost the vacuum inside the air intake with their big open air box and the slide would not open all the way, equivalent to putting a block under the gas pedal.


Why am I telling you this? Saving you some hard earned money when the stock system will work fine with the right jet kit and slight opening in the lid.

Buy a intake got to get a jet kit anyway, so I say buy a jet kit and get the $45 TPI valves to go with the right kit.

I'm going broke buying products and testing them to sell to only find out most don't work. If anyone disagrees with me, send me one and I will test it plus I will pay return shipping.

Most of you know I will give whatever it is a fair shot and if I am wrong we will sell it for the company!!



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post #2 of 9 (permalink) Old 10-08-2008, 11:19 PM
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Todd, you just gave me a flashback to my first fire hydraulics class 20+ years ago. I guess the only thing that would change the formula would be a Turbo or supercharger. (back to the dyno!)
Thanks for ALL the information.

Sometimes you can out trick yourself with all the new toys....................
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post #3 of 9 (permalink) Old 10-09-2008, 06:41 AM Thread Starter
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That's right about the turbo.



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post #4 of 9 (permalink) Old 10-09-2008, 08:19 AM
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So if you add performance cams & pistons do you not need more air?
Or is the size of the intake/exhaust ports your limits?
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post #5 of 9 (permalink) Old 10-09-2008, 08:25 AM Thread Starter
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Doug,

It is hard for me to answer something I have not done yet but in theory even adding those items won't change the need for the vacuum even though it will be different. You might would simply add another TPI valve to the lid and still be way less expensvie than a aftermarket intake.

yes you would need more air, to answer your question. I know porting does good but it normally does it on the top end only.

I steer my research to the average guy. The average guy will NOT buy a brand new vehicle and go into the motor right off the bat. The majority want simple bolt on items that work and that is our main focus.

I let more experienced poeple like Mickey at FST do the motor work and make recommendations for what is needed to go with his parts.

Cams is about as far as I will go on this motor.

I want to add something hear. We all believe everryone selling something is telling the truth and they have researched it well. WE all want more and when a company selling whatever tells us it will do what we want, we go for it. Now I don't believe every company sets out to mislead people I just think they don't test the right way to. The air intake that they only tested on the flow bench is a great example. They thought they were doing good with all this new flow, more air must mean more power, right? It does if you can use it.

What they did and many others is make something and test something that just flows better not performs better.

How about this. I got a new fuel pump that will flow 65 gallons per hour versus the stock pump at 11 gallons per hour, we get more power because we can pump more fuel. Sounds logical huh? Ok, but my engine won't burn but 5 gallons an hour so why do I need the 60 extra gallons per hour now? These number are fictitional not actually what the stock system would flow, but you get the point.

So the guy who makes the pump thinks he is doing us a good thing because he has tunnel vision and never looks past his pump at the need for the extra fuel.

To get this or any engine to work with any high flowing intake you will have to do something to require more air, cams, larger pistons, turbo etc. then you will have to replace your vacuum carbs with mechanical slide carbs so they are not suceptable to the vacuum needed.




Last edited by Hunterworks; 10-09-2008 at 08:42 AM.
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post #6 of 9 (permalink) Old 10-10-2008, 01:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hunterworks View Post
Been thinking about some ads I see for intakes and most sport some pretty lofty air flow numbers. Sounds great huh? Not really.

The Teryx motor at 100% efficiency can't pump but about 90 CFM if I remember right, it has been a while since I calculated it. The engine may be 90% efficient at best so we are down to only 81 cfm. So if the air pump (engine) can only pump 81 cfm do we need a air intake that will flow more? If it will flow 81 then we have enough period.

I like to use analogies and I like to use water and pipes for it, I guess because I was a fire fighter for 17 plus years.

Say you went and bought a brand new water hose nozzle that will flow 50 gallons per minute (GPM) and you had a water hose that would flow 55 GPM. Now your neighbor comes over and tells you, you need to borrow his new 5" water hose that flows 1000 GPM and then you can rinse your UTV off quicker. You tell him your nozzle will only flow 50 GPM, he says yeah but mine hose flows way more, again you tell him the nozzle will only let out 50 GPM and since your present hose will flow 55 gpm you already can't flow what your own hose can flow and then he finally gets it and realizes, "Crap that guy at the Big Flowing Hoses Store tricked me" Believing his new 5" hose was the bomb now he realizes that his big hideous looking hose is way over kill for any use at all.

There was a air intake company who built a air intake for a Rhino and never dyno tested it on a Rhino before they made it, but they sure put it on the flow bench and showed how much it would flow. Guess what happen when we put it on the Rhino? It would run out out of power before the stock intake would and it was because they lost the vacuum inside the air intake with their big open air box and the slide would not open all the way, equivalent to putting a block under the gas pedal.


Why am I telling you this? Saving you some hard earned money when the stock system will work fine with the right jet kit and slight opening in the lid.

Buy a intake got to get a jet kit anyway, so I say buy a jet kit and get the $45 TPI valves to go with the right kit.

I'm going broke buying products and testing them to sell to only find out most don't work. If anyone disagrees with me, send me one and I will test it plus I will pay return shipping.

Most of you know I will give whatever it is a fair shot and if I am wrong we will sell it for the company!!
I will send you my AFE intake, it is the complete one with the metal box and everything. The only thing it did for my Teryx was make the intake noise louder than the Muzzy's Exxhaust system. My wife hated it, and I do want her to ride with me, so it has sat on my workbench for months. Looks kinda cool on the bench and is much quieter.

No need to send it back, if you also don't like it just sell it to help cover some of your time for all the testing you do for all of us. I will try my best to get it out today, since I have a couple of other boxes to ship, it should go out. I will send it to the HunterWorks address on your website, please PM me if you want it to go to another address. Interested to hear if you think it does anything other than make noise.

2011 Teryx Sport
2011 50" STD RZR LE

Last edited by Magellan; 10-10-2008 at 02:00 AM.
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post #7 of 9 (permalink) Old 10-10-2008, 06:19 AM Thread Starter
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Sounds cool to me, I will have to find my stock diaphragm springs.



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post #8 of 9 (permalink) Old 10-10-2008, 07:05 AM
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Sounds cool to me, I will have to find my stock diaphragm springs.
Boxed up, label printed ready to ship. It will be there USPS Priority Mail in a couple of days. You will receive the email directly from the USPS. Thanks for testing this intake.

2011 Teryx Sport
2011 50" STD RZR LE

Last edited by Magellan; 10-10-2008 at 07:51 AM.
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post #9 of 9 (permalink) Old 10-10-2008, 08:15 AM Thread Starter
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Thanks, I should be able to get right on it.



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